Parin Sachedina: Welsh Asian Heritage Project

 

Farah Allibhai  00:00

Farah Allibhai recording Parin Sachedina on the 29th of April 2024, can you please introduce yourself.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  00:09

Of course so I’m Parin Sachedina, I was born in Fort Portal, Uganda. It's from what I'm told and what I understand, it was a beautifully green and luscious town. 

And I was five years old when I left Uganda to come to Britain. 

 

Farah Allibhai

So you were born when? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

In 1967.

 

Farah Allibhai  00:35

So do you have any early memories of growing up there?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  00:42

I don't have too many memories. But I have a few vague memories and I remember, it was quite hilly in the town that we lived. And I remember rolling down the hills in banana leaves. I must have enjoyed it very much because that memory has stayed with me. And I remember just being quite carefree. I was only five when we left. I was very young. I remember playing with hay and in the grass and in the sun. But beyond that, I don't have any vivid memories other than that.

 

Farah Allibhai  01:26

Was rolling around in banana leaves something... an occupation for most children? Sounds like a lot of fun.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  01:32

Yeah I think certainly my siblings did it. So I'm sure it must have been for a lot more children than just my siblings and I.

 

Farah Allibhai  01:39

How many siblings do you have?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  01:42

So I have well, there are four of us - two brothers and two sisters. So there's four of us. I recently lost my brother. So now we are three.

 

Farah Allibhai  01:55

I'm sorry to hear that. And were you all born in Uganda?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  01:59

Yes we were all born in Uganda. Yes. In Fort Portal.

 

Farah Allibhai  02:01

And your parents, what did they do in Uganda?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  02:06

Yes, so my father had a big shop, it was almost like a supermarket so it sold everything. So the best way I can describe it is a smaller version of a large Sainsbury's or an Asda or Tesco, something like that. So it sold, you know, food, clothes, household things. So and it was quite a successful business, it was doing very well.

 

Farah Allibhai  02:30

And did your mum work in the shop as well? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  02:33

She did. My mum did I mean, she was part housewife, but worked in the shop as well, yes.

 

Farah Allibhai  02:38

And were your employees, your father's employees, were they Ugandan Asian or Ugandan African?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  02:47

Do you know, I don't know. But I know that they would have probably been Ugandan African.

 

Farah Allibhai  02:53

So you had quite a comfortable lifestyle in Uganda.

 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  02:56

We did yes, we certainly did. Yes.

 

Farah Allibhai  03:00

Was that something your father established on his own? Or did he have any sort of assistance with inherited wealth?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  03:07

Well, he certainly didn't have inherited wealth. My father was one of four brothers. And they were all born in India. And the three of his brothers moved from India to Uganda to get themselves set up. And  my dad was the youngest of the four. And he stayed with his mum to make sure she was okay. But she insisted that when he came to age that he should go and join his brothers and make his career and develop his life in Uganda because the opportunities were far stronger there. So he did that, you know, it was a bit of a wrench for him to leave his mum because my grandfather, my father's father, passed away when he was very young, when my father was eight years old. So there was no inherited wealth. There was no real direction. He came to see his brothers, but I don't know it just didn't work out. So at a very young age, probably in his teenage years, my dad was left alone to fend for himself. So I think it took a long time for him to establish himself and he got married quite late to my mum, I think when he was about 38. So he got married quite late on in life, compared to what people in that day and age would have done. And he then had us quite late in his life, you know, in his 40s, and then by that age 40 to 50. He really got established, I think, you know, having a family, having that set of responsibilities, I think must have been quite a driving force for him to get established, which is what he did.

 

Farah Allibhai  04:59

So that's a really, really big journey from India, which part of India?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  05:04

From Bhuj, which is in the Gujarat state.

 

Farah Allibhai  05:09

And so he left his mother there. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

So do you know how your grandmother's survived in India?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  05:15

I don't actually I think we must have had relatives, you know, where she was able to, to have support from other relatives and family members there. I don't know too much about that. My dad never really said much because he was a young boy, he was only 13 when he left. And I think it was just a very difficult time for him.

 

Farah Allibhai  05:40

It sounds like the whole journey was difficult, coming to a different country at 13. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  05:46

Yeah it was he, you know, he got into company that probably wasn't good. That probably wasn't good for him. But I think he eventually found his way.

 

 

 

Farah Allibhai  05:57

And Uganda afforded him that opportunity, even though he worked very hard, clearly, to get to where he was, you know, with the supermarket?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  06:07

Yeah, I think there were opportunities there. You know, there were people that he knew that had factories that had, you know, businesses that he would then, you know, I think started to work in I don't know too much of the detail. But I remember him telling me, he worked in a cotton mill, for example, and places like that, where, for him, it was just about earning money, and whilst living at his brother's houses, being able to contribute something, you know, but beyond that, then developing something for himself too, so.

 

Farah Allibhai  06:42

And I suppose without having a profession, going into sales shop work would be the natural, in inverted commas, natural route to go to have more of a quality of life.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  06:57

I think so I think Ugandan Asians were very entrepreneurial. And you know, when you hang around with enough entrepreneurial people, you seem, you know, you naturally will develop the urge to have your own businesses, set up your own business, to do your own thing. And I think that's really what happened. And you know, when you know other people who are in similar businesses, you can learn the tricks of the trade, you can learn what to do and how to do it. So I think that's the path that he then embarked on having other people in a similar business and knowing how it then operated.

 

Farah Allibhai  07:33

So expulsion was quite an uproot for you and your family after your father had spent most of his life, much of his life trying to establish some foundations and then have that wrenched away. Do you have any memories of the expulsion?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  07:49

I have two memories, but not as much as what my siblings do, because they were much older than me. My memories, again, very vague. I remember being on a bus, and there was a lot of noise, and it was very scary. And then, you know, talking to my family, it transpires that that was the bus that was taking us to the airport. We were not allowed to take anything with us. And the noise was, I think, based around the fact that my mum had smuggled a photograph of her wedding photograph. And the army officers said she couldn't take it. And there was a bit of a kerfuffle, and they smashed it. And that's, that's the memory I had, but not you know, as vivid as that. But I remember it being scary and the noise, but that's really what happened. 

And then the second memory I have is actually arriving at Heathrow, I didn't know it was Heathrow at the time. But I remember it being very dark, and very cold. And having come from a very hot climate, coming here in I think was November time was quite cold, very dark. And I remember us being ushered into a room there were, there were things to try on. I think we were all trying on coats and I just remember my mum trying on this beautiful turquoise long coat. And that was a fond memory for some reason I don’t know if it was the colour of the coat, or the way my mum - I remember my mum looking in it. But yeah, so those are the only two memories I have.

 

Farah Allibhai  09:39

And what happened and then when you arrived?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  09:45

Well can I just tell you about one or two of the memories that my siblings told me about? 

 

Farah Allibhai

Absolutely

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

And my father told me about it. It was such a scary time and my dad used to tell us his story about how he went to get our passports done, because we didn't have passports. And he said that if you looked at an officer in the eye, they would very likely hurt you, if not shoot you. 

 

Farah Allibhai

These were Ugandan...?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Officers, yeah - the military officers. And so it was a very scary time for him to navigate through that. But also, my sister, I remember her telling me this, this awful thing, that where she used to walk to school, and there was a river that she used to pass walking to school, and she'd see dead bodies floating on the river. So I didn't have any memories of that. But all I can say is from listening to my family, and you know, other people that it, it was just a horrendous time for everybody what they went through - the fear, not just in losing everything that they had, but also potentially losing their lives, losing their loved ones, because it was such an erratic time. You know, the military officers were just completely inconsistent, spontaneous with, you know, with how they treated people with their attacks. And so yes, so, you know, I've been told that. 

 

 

Farah Allibhai  11:17

How does that sit with you? How did that sit with you growing up knowing that that was the experience, the lived experience of your family, and a bit of a legacy of how you left Uganda?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  11:29

I don't know. I mean, I just marvel at human nature and the survival instinct, you know, that, despite everything that people go through, they still have something within them that needs them to move forward, to adapt. And to continue, and to move on. So, you know, that in itself is quite impressive.

 

Farah Allibhai  11:55

And this, the fear that the family felt on leaving, how would you feel that that affected them on arrival here.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  12:03

I think when they came to Britain, it was a different kind of fear. It wasn't a fear of survival anymore, or whether I'm going to be shot down, or whether I'm going to, you know, lose one of my siblings or my parents, so it wasn't that kind of fear anymore. It was now the fear of a new environment, the fear of being able to adapt or not, or, you know, what the future held. So the fear was different. 

 

Farah Allibhai

But it was still there.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

So it was still there, but in a very different way.

 

Farah Allibhai  12:38

And when you were at Heathrow, do you remember where you were put, did you go into a camp?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  12:45

Yes, we did. We went into a camp near Rugby. 

 

Farah Allibhai

Do you know the name of it. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yes. Gaydon.

 

Farah Allibhai  12:51

You were at Gaydon camp, so the other Ismailis were at Gaydon Camp as well?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  12:55

Yes, that's right. Yeah. Yeah, it was. I don't remember much of Gaydon actually. I remember we were sent to school there was, or some kind of learning establishment that was a very, very long walk. And there was one shop on that route. And I used to walk with my brother. And yeah, he used to scare me to death, saying that there are ghosts on this trail. You know what brothers are like? But yes, I think there was like, three or four or five families staying together in a very small space. Yeah, it was quite cramped. But again, my memories of that are very, very vague.

 

Farah Allibhai  13:40

Do you know how long you were at the camp for?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  13:44

I don't remember, no.

 

Farah Allibhai  13:45

So what happened then?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  13:46

Maybe just under a year, I think.

 

Farah Allibhai

Just under a year? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

I think so, yes. 

 

Farah Allibhai  

So that's quite some time to be spending in the camp. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yeah.

 

Farah Allibhai  13:56

So really, camp was home.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  13:58

For a while, yes, yeah. I knew we went through Christmas because one of my cousins dressed up as Father Christmas and never seen that before. But yeah, it must have been, I don't know, maybe around nine months perhaps all together. 

 

Farah Allibhai  14:16

And you say that you've never seen Father Christmas before? That wasn't something that was celebrated in Uganda, then?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  14:21

I wouldn't have thought so, no.

 

Farah Allibhai  14:24

And so your family or the people in the camp fully embraced the festive season.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  14:33

Either they did that or they were made to I'm not sure. I don't think they were made to but I think why not? You know, it's a happy occasion why not?

 

Farah Allibhai  14:42

Where were you in settled then after being in the camp for almost a year?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  14:47

So we were put in a housing estate in Nuneaton, so it was a council housing estate. I later found out that it was one of the roughest council housing estates, there were apparently curfews there. So nobody was allowed to leave the estate after half past 10. I didn't understand why that would be or what the cause would be. But I think that's because there was a lot of... a number of families who were convicts, you know, who were ex criminals. So I don't know if that was a reason for a curfew. But yeah, so we lived in a three bedroom, were we placed in a three bedroom house, it was tiny. But then, you know, it was our own house, council house. And I remember that there was an elderly couple living across the road. And as soon as we moved in, maybe an hour later, they knocked on the door and introduced themselves and said, look, if you need anything, you know, just please come and ask us. And they become, became very good friends of ours. Mr. And Mrs. Rowley still remember their names. So yeah, so that's where our life began. And we stayed stay there for almost 11-12 years.

 

Farah Allibhai  16:13

And how was it growing up on, unbeknown to you, one of the roughest states in Nuneaton?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  16:18

Yeah, it was called Black-A-Tree Road, it was an interesting name. Do you know, it was fine, and we thought we'd have so much trouble, but we didn't and I was absolutely amazed. Our neighbours were very nice. Mr. and Mrs. Rowley across the road were very helpful. I think people understood our plight, it must have been on the media, it must have been on the news. And I think they appreciated that we were thrown out of our country without any option. And this is where we were put so I think there was a level of understanding, so we didn't have any trouble. And then as I got older and went to school I made friends with one of the girls on the estate. And I didn't realise then, but she had six brothers and they'd all been in and out of prison and were the most feared family in the estate. And I didn't know that but because I was friends with Angela, their sister, you know we were actually okay.

 

Farah Allibhai  17:23

So it worked in your favour? 

 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  17:31

Yeah, yeah, it did actually. Yeah, we'd walk home together. And we went back and yeah, so it did. It did in that estate anyway, we didn't have any trouble there.

 

Farah Allibhai  17:39

Did you find it difficult culturally, with your mum and dad? And then growing up on a very typical British estates in a sense? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  17:49

Oh, yes. I mean, you know, we weren't allowed to go out in the evening, we weren't allowed to play with our friends, we weren't allowed to socialise with anybody else at school. My parents were quite - my father was very strict. And, you know, he didn't want us to get into bad crowds, knowing that he had been in a bad crowd himself, and what that does to somebody's trajectory in life. And so he kept us very sheltered indeed, which was tough, because it meant that going to school, we couldn't go to birthday parties, we couldn't go to evening activities, we couldn't socialise in a way that all my friends were able to socialise. And that meant that I felt quite isolated from friendship groups, and things like that. 

 

Farah Allibhai  18:37

So do you think this exclusion was read along kind of cultural lines, not just a father being, for want of a better word, overprotective? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  18:48

I think it's both, isn't it? Yes. Because yes, he was overly protective. But from a cultural point of view, there are, you know, we were brought up with ways of behaving. And you know, that the reputation of a family very much depends on the reputation of the children and especially the daughters. And so from that point of view, we weren't allowed to do or go anywhere that would compromise that. 

 

Farah Allibhai  19:21

Even though he wasn't actually living within his own, your own community. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  19:26

Yeah even though we were quite far away from our community, which must have been very difficult for them. Because, you know, in Fort Portal, we had his Ismailis living all around us, our Jamatkhana was very close, and the social environment was very strong. And all of a sudden, he's placed in England in a little town called Nuneaton, where there were no Ismailis in that town, and they couldn't drive, didn't have transport to then take themselves to where our nearest Jamatkhana was or where our, you know, relatives were. So it was, must have been a very difficult transition for them. But coming back to the point, yes, I think for him preserving the reputation of our family. And you know, the quality of respect that the children, you know, were nurtured within was very important to him. Yeah.

 

Farah Allibhai  20:25

What did your father do when he came to the UK after having had this business?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  20:30

Well, he struggled to find work because there was a language barrier, couldn't speak English very well. He did eventually work in a factory. And he did that for many years. But then his... remember when he came here was already in his 50s. So he, I think, due to health issues, he then gave that job up, mainly because his eyesight was so bad, and he couldn't do the work properly. And that's it. That was the last he worked.

 

Farah Allibhai  20:59

And what about your mum, did she stay at home?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  21:00

She was always at home, yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

Did she speak English fluently?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Not fluently but she did. She picked up as much as she could, yeah.

 

Farah Allibhai  21:10

So was it mostly the children that were speaking English and advocating for their parents in your household, as was with a lot of Ugandan Asian refugees?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  21:21

Yes, I mean, we'd be taking the brunt of anything that required English. Yes. Yeah. Because they, weren't educated. And I think, for my dad, he was just much older. But having said that, they picked up the language. They did, they spoke to a degree. 

 

Farah Allibhai  21:41

But a lot of responsibility fell on the, your siblings, and I'm assuming that you were one of the younger ones

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  21:47

I was, I was third. And then I had a younger brother. But yes, so for example, in parents evening, you know, my parents didn’t come to my parents evening, my eldest sister came to my parents evening, and I had to sometimes go with her, which was a bit strange, I think, for the teachers to be talking about me in front of me, it was a bit peculiar. But yeah, so my older siblings had to take on that role, which was, I think, I found that difficult. I wanted my parents to be involved with that, but they, they really weren't. But I mean, I look back at my mother's life, and she was never educated. She was one of nearly 13-14 siblings, and she was the second eldest. And her life from the age of 10, was very much as a housekeeper, you know, helping to cook and clean for all her other siblings, you know, with her eldest sister and her mum and etc. So she'd never been educated and she lacked a huge amount of confidence in herself. She'd never been pushed to do anything other than be a housewife, really. So I think it was quite a stretch for her to go to a school. So you know, for example, I was in the choir, and I was lead singer in the choir, and I do all these plays. And then after the play had finished, all the parents would come to their children and say, oh, you did a wonderful job. And I just packed my bag and walk home. Because there was nobody there to see my plays. 

 

Farah Allibhai  23:22

But you were able to take part in them, which is a delightful thing. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yes, I did. 

 

Farah Allibhai  

Yeah. So that's credit to yourself there for that, how beautiful. So there were many challenges growing up along the way. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  23:37

Yeah there were huge challenges. Yeah, for sure.

 

Farah Allibhai  23:39

And how did you overcome? How did you meet them? And what were some of them?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  23:44

Well, I think there's a couple of things. I mean, we were lucky that Jamatkhana was very important. And we had somebody from our Jamatkhana that would come and pick us up on a Friday. And I think having that link to our community, just being able to pray, I think in all of my life, in all of the biggest challenges that I've had in my life, the opportunity to silence your mind and pray with a group of people that you know, that with whom you have a sense of belonging, I think has been a very powerful thing for me in terms of just helping me rationalise, re-energise and just think differently about certain things.

 

 

Farah Allibhai  24:45

So, for yourself, did you stay on at school or how did that work for you?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  24:52

So I did that. Yes, I stayed at school I went to college but very quickly, I think my sister got married when she was 19. So she left home, my brothers left home and I was the only one left at home. And I just didn't feel comfortable leaving my parents isolated. So at the age of 16, I thought, right, I'm going to study but I'm going to earn money. And my motivation for, for doing that was a number of things. I think, first, we had very little, you know, I remember going to Jamatkhana, I'd always be wearing the same stuff. So I thought, I need some money to buy some clothes. But beyond that, it was just being able to contribute to the house. Being able to potentially drive one day, so at the age of 16, I got a sales job. And I remember, you know, I used to work two evenings a week and Saturdays. And I enjoyed it, it was getting on the phone, talking to people booking appointments. But what happened out of that was, I developed my confidence in a way that I hadn't had the chance to do anything else before, you know, I was talking to different people, I was encouraged to talk to people, I was given a little bit of training. And so this was like, the big wide world now, you know, I was still studying, I was still only 16. But this was like the big wide world that I hadn't entered, you know, being so restricted and, but I was making money, and I was able to, when I turned 17 pay for my own driving lessons. And I was able to buy my own car. And that really changed the face of our lives, you know, certainly for my parents, because then I was able to take them very easily to community events, community functions, to weddings to other things. So now they had a much stronger sense of belonging than they had before. So that was great.

 

Farah Allibhai  26:55

And a greater sense of connection to the local community as well being able to pootle around in the car with you and do things.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Absolutely yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

And then that's those sorts of things that do make a difference to how you perceive your environment and how you fit into your environment.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  27:11

Yes, absolutely. So yeah, and we could get around, we'd be invited to places without having to worry about how we were going to get there. So it was great. And, you know, but having said that my father, even though we weren't able to go to Jamatkhana, when we're younger all the time, we still managed to get to places because the community was great, you know, people looked after each other. And you know, we'd always get a lift here and there. My dad did voluntary service, he was the only one that did all the Ghusl services for funerals. 

 

Farah Allibhai  27:52

Do you mind just explaining what Ghusl is. 

 

 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  27:56

So, I’ll see if I can explain it properly. But my father would preside over... when somebody passed away, he'd helped to bathe the body to dress the body. And he'd pray over the body, sometimes sit with the body. And then he’d be part of conducting the prayers, and specifically Fateha in the evening ceremonies at Jamatkhana. So that's the role he played. He did that for 40 years from, all together, both in Fort Portal and in England, so altogether he did he did that for 40 years. So he, he was very dedicated to that level of service and, and that took him all around the country, because there was no other person that could do it in the way that he could do it in the early days. And because he was known to do it in Fort Portal, people would come to him. And one of the things that I remember, it was quite extraordinary, really, my father had a beautiful voice and so did my mum. And we used to have these music parties at home, you know, my dad would get the harmonium out, and we'd all sing together. It was a beautiful thing. We just sing and we'd have guests come over, and we'd sing together. You know, we'd have dinner we'd sing and we used to have these mini music parties that are home and it was brilliant fun. But the way he recited Fateha was beautiful. And so many people used to say to him that, you know, Ibraham bhai, you know, if I die, will you make sure that you do my Fateha? And you know, and he promised so many people, so he kept going, you know, he kept doing it and he kept doing it because he promised to many people. It was a wonderful thing for him because that gave him I don't know, recognition of, you know, the work that he had been doing. But he got a medal from the Imam, you know, for his service.

 

Farah Allibhai  30:13

And that's a real necessary and dedicated service to his community. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  30:19

Yeah so people would come from Liverpool, from Derby from Nottingham to pick him up and take him to do all of this stuff, all of his seva and his funeral service. And yes, and then they'd drop him back. But then when I got the car, that was my responsibility then. So I then had to take him everywhere. So I can't tell you Farah how many funerals and weddings I've actually been to in my life. But it's been quite a lot, yeah.

 

Farah Allibhai  30:51

How incredible to be in to give that level of service to your parents as well. Quite a lot of young people might feel resentful of having to do that for you seem to have willingly wanted to support your family, your parents in that sense?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  31:05

Yes. You know, I don't know why I did. My, siblings couldn't wait to leave home. But I just, I didn't know something inside of me, just said that I needed and wanted to just make sure they're okay. You know, having known that their backgrounds were not easy. Having known that, you know, life was very difficult for them. And that they probably did the best they could, that just to leave and go off on my own path, merry way, was probably not something that sat well with me. So it was a driving force to make sure that they were okay. And, you know, me starting work early and being able to earn money forged -  you know, there was a driving force there that I think, really got me focused on what I wanted to do, you know, in life. And I think that's a good thing, when you're young sometimes you think well, what am I going to do? Sometimes you can spend a, you know, another 5-10 years in education and still not know what you want to do. But for me, I knew I wanted to make money. I knew I wanted to get a car. I knew I wanted to contribute to the house. You know, there were these little minor milestones that set me on a path of study, and earning and being in a job that set a platform, I guess, for my career today.

 

Farah Allibhai  32:38

And what has that been?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  32:41

Well, I started in sales, and I continued that career for about 10 years in different forms and different companies. And I was achieving a great deal of success. And then I used to mentor different salespeople. And, you know, one thing led to another and then I embarked on my first training role, which was managing a whole training function, a sales training function for an international organisation. And I did very well there because everything that I learned in my training career, I was able to compartmentalise in into a learning and development programme that enabled these new salespeople going through this programme to achieve 60% more revenue than anybody had before. And that won 4 industry awards. And so, I was then doing work at a much higher level. So then my next role was head of sales, learning and development for a group of 13 recruitment businesses that were growing from 100 million to 500 million so then, you know, my career really took off after that.

 

Farah Allibhai  34:01

Really quite incredible. And do you feel that this ambition I think lies within your family? Because your father, you know, throughout his, though, he had his challenges his struggles, he achieved something so I suppose that is a wonderful model to have, but do you think that also being an independent woman was something that you derived from the community, from being a Ismaili was that something that was inculcated culturally?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  34:36

I think that independence came from part in myself. And our community is very good in in driving home, the value of education, the value of progress, and the value of developing one's self. So, you know, that ethic of our faith is ingrained in us, you know, from a very young age. And so that, those things were important to me as a result of, you know, listening to that value and to those ethics consistently growing up. But I think my father, also, you know, he was very much in terms of work he was, you know, he was very much about, you know, do your best work as hard as you can. And he didn't force me into doing or being, or going into one specific type of career he was very much about, you do what you feel comfortable in, you know, he didn't say, okay, I want you to be an accountant, I want you to be a doctor, I want you to be a lawyer. He didn't put any of that pressure on me, it was just about what we felt most comfortable with, what was right for us. And I actually didn't know what was right for me, I didn't know what I wanted to do. Sales was something I fell into, because it was a job that I could get, and job that I seem to do well at. And I continued that until I figured out what I wanted to do once I was still studying. But I didn't go to university because I thought, you know, I can get a job now, full time job having had about three or four years experience already under my belt. So then that's what I did. 

 

Farah Allibhai  36:23

And it didn't actually disserve you because you went on to have a very good career you know managing and all these accolades. Can you tell me then how did you end up living in Wales and when did you come here?

 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  36:38

I met my partner, Stuart, who is Welsh, and lives in Cardiff who lived in Cardiff when I met him, and still does. And so we eventually got together. And I moved here 12 and a half years ago.

 

Farah Allibhai  36:57

And how did you meet?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  37:00

We met at a conference in ExCeL. Yeah, so I don't know if you ever... was it ExCeL? Yes, it was ExCeL. So you know, where in the foyer, you'd have these cafes and so yeah, so I was having a break, and having a sandwich and a coffee. And he was not far away from me doing the same thing. And we started talking. And that's how it happened.

 

Farah Allibhai  37:30

So you're at the same conference? What was the conference? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  37:32

No, it wasn't same conference. He was in his. I was in a financial wealth management conference. And he was in a media conference, yeah.

 

Farah Allibhai  37:43

So he's works in media, then. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yes, that's right. 

 

Farah Allibhai

Oh, okay. So you're from different career paths, but it works. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yes, it does, yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

And he convinced you to come to Cardiff? 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  37:58

No, so we, we started dating, and we became very serious. And then, you know, I was expecting our first child. So then we decided to move, so then I decided to move to Cardiff because his family was here. And I was in London and my family are dispersed all over the country. So it made sense for me to come here. 

 

Farah Allibhai  38:23

And whereabouts your husband's family in Wales.

 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  38:26

So his mum lives in Newport, that's where he was born. And his children were not so far away. They lived with their mother at the time, they’ve have grown up now and moved away. And they're currently both in Europe now. But yeah, so it was easier for them to come here, you know, every other weekend, and for them to come here on holidays, and for Stuart to go and see them. So he had his children here, his mum here. Yeah. And his business here so he had his production company here, his colleagues here, so all of his infrastructure is very much in around Cardiff.

 

Farah Allibhai  39:04

And that wasn't something that daunted you, that you were quite willing to embrace.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  39:09

Yes, absolutely.

 

Farah Allibhai  39:12

And he's not from a dissimilar background to you, in a sense.

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

No, he’s not.

 

Farah Allibhai

For somebody working in the media, could you tell us a little bit more...

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  39:21

About him? 

 

Farah Allibhai

Yeah. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

So he grew up in a place called Bettws in a council estate that was sounded worse than the one I grew up in. And, you know, he grew up without knowing his father. So single mum, three children. So again, not much money around and you know, I think we were both bullied at school for different reasons. You know, I was the only Indian girl growing up in a school full of, I don't know, 800 people. And I was always picked on virtually every single day. But he was picked on for different reasons, you know, probably because he wasn't in the most popular crowd or because he was probably smaller, or that, you know, not as strong as other kids. So, yeah, and he was bullied quite a lot. So have we had similar issues, or similar challenges, but for very different reasons.

 

Farah Allibhai  40:33

Going back to the racism you experienced in school, how did - and if it was daily, how did you deal with that? How did you process that? Was there anybody who would talk to about it?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  40:45

Not really, not really, nobody to talk to. You just got on with it, we had to I think, you develop a certain amount of resilience, you know, when you when you've had the kind of experience that our family has, you have to have a certain type of experience. But I guess my, you know, the message that my parents would give me is saying, look, these people are not very nice to you, that's a bigger reflection on their character than it is yours. So just ignore them. Do the best and do what you need to do. Just block that away. And we had to just get on with it. You know, we didn't have people to talk to we didn't have, you know, anybody that would put their arms around us and say it's going to be alright, no, we just had to deal with it. That's what it was.

 

Farah Allibhai  41:42

So back to you and Stuart, your partner. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

And you're here now in Cardiff and have been for the last 12 years you said 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yeah. 12 and a half years, yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

Okay. And you have a daughter as well. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yep. 

 

Farah Allibhai

And how old is she now?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  41:57

She's going to be 12 in a few weeks time. Yeah.

 

Farah Allibhai  42:00

Wonderful. And she has a Welsh heritage and an Asian heritage as well. And what would, how does she identify herself, if at all?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  42:14

You know, it's not something that we talk about, but it's a really good question. When it suits her, she's of Welsh background, and when it suits her she's of Indian background, which is the best way. 

 

Farah Allibhai

Does that mean you are spoiling her in the family and the community?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

Yeah, I think so. No, I think it's, you know, she speaks very good English, but then she has this amazing Welsh accent. And then that's her, you know, putting on her Welsh heritage. Now, I think it's an interesting question. She regards herself, because I'm still taking her to Jamatkhana. She's learned her prayers, you know, she enjoys the festivals, that we go to, she goes to religious classes every week, you know, online. So she's very much entrenched in our faith, and she loves going to Jamatkhana. And she loves being a volunteer, and she loves all that side of it. So on a day to day basis, she practices more of her cultural and Indian heritage than she would her Welsh heritage. So I would assume, but it's the question I would have to ask her that she would identify with that. But I think she also understands she calls herself Welsh.

 

Farah Allibhai  43:41

Well she has a Welsh grandmother here that she sees every week. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA

That's right, yeah. 

 

Farah Allibhai

So very close connection. I think those having grandparents there for you, does give a stronger sense of identity. You know, because of all the things that they share and their experiences, and so on. And so she's a very good practising Ismaili Muslim, by all accounts, better than most... well, better than me, that's for sure. So how important is it for you to have a Jamatkhana here in Cardiff?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  44:14

I think it's very important because when I came here, I didn't know anybody. And then I phoned up, you know, our head of Jamatkhana. And immediately you go into a new Jamatkhana, especially a small one like in like we have in Cardiff and everybody wants to talk to you, and immediately you have a sense of belonging. It's a beautiful thing. It's one of the, I think the most exciting and important things of being an Ismaili is that you can go to so many places in the world and go to Jamatkhana and be part of a group of people immediately that you have a link with. I think that is a very beautiful thing. So I was for example, I was in Mombasa one time for a trip and I stayed in this hotel called the Bamburi Beach Hotel. And then I found out there was a Jamatkhana, 10 minutes walk from this hotel, and I went and it was, I don't know, 25-30 people, and it was wonderful, you know, everybody talks to you, everybody greets you. And, you know, I'm 1000s of miles away from home. But I'm still with a group of people that are my community.

 

Farah Allibhai  45:25

And there's a sense of safety and belonging. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  45:29

Yes, absolutely. It's, it's extraordinary. And that's what I tried to get through to Ariane, because you know, life is for me anyway, about people. It's the quality of relationships you have with people. And sometimes it's hard to find, you know, people to have those relationships with. But when you have a community that you have already, something in common, so strongly in common with, you can create those relationships all over the world. And you know, every summer there are discovery camps for children her age, you know, youth camps. And she went to one not knowing anybody, bless her, last year and she made a couple of friends from that people who live in different parts of the world, you know, that she'll do that again this year, and she'll forge those stronger relationships, and she'll build a, I'm hoping a worldwide network of Ismaili, young people that she knows and is friendly with. You know, where else can you get that opportunity? I think it's very, very special indeed.

 

Farah Allibhai  46:36

It was really a great opportunity to develop social skills, isn't it?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  46:40

Absolutely. From a young age, she has been asked to read in Jamatkhana. You know, she's got now really great reading skills, and confidence, because she's been, you know, encouraged to do that. Yeah, so there are so many - our faith is not just about praying in Jamatkhana, it's about so much more, so much more. And when you delve deeper into our institutions, and the value they provide, and the support they provide for our community, my mind is blown every time because I did 14 years of service in social welfare, our social welfare committee and just training our social service volunteers to go and help people who are suffering from some kind of trauma is absolutely extraordinary, because one of those volunteers helped my father after my mum passed away. And they did just the most amazing job. So because I was in the training background, I was then asked to join that committee to help train the other volunteers.

 

Farah Allibhai  47:42

Who have a real lived experience of how this can impact and enhance?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  47:46

Absolutely, absolutely. So it's, I just find it an extraordinary community to be a part of, it's not perfect, nothing is perfect in life. But I think what I've learned from a very young age is that you've got to grab the good and focus on the good and everything because if you don't, everything becomes so much darker.

 

Farah Allibhai  48:08

There's some really great wisdom there. Thank you very much indeed. But before we conclude, I’d just like, what was your first impressions of when you came to Wales?

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  48:17

Oh, my goodness, it rained, it rained constantly. I thought, where did I, where have I come to? I've never seen so much rain seriously. I was, you know, the first year and it's got better since then. But the first year I didn't know what it was. It just rained constantly. I was like, oh my god. And London, obviously we got rain, but not it just didn't feel to this level. So that was my first impression. But you know, I have to say, I loved the area that we live, you know, there's parks and there's a lovely lake, near where we live and just walking around there on most days, it's just a beautiful thing. So whereas when I was living in London, we didn't have that, you know, it was traffic congestion, smoke. So I really enjoyed it, and now I couldn't really think of living in London. 

 

Farah Allibhai

Thank you very much indeed. 

 

PARIN SACHEDINA  

Thank you